Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 8 guests, and 38 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
 Trending Topics(Posts)
1.Ask Amy's very bad advice on affairs2
2.The Joke Thread2
3.Things men want1
4.Hearts Blessing1
5.Financial counselor says communication is key when mixing money and marriage - Grand Forks Herald0
6.Daughter says father made ominous threats if his wife sought a divorce - Portland Press Herald0
7.A Straight Spouse Of A Gay Husband Speaks Out0
8.Rise Above Past Relationship Failures - Psychology Today0
9.Toxic Relationship dynamics0
10.Women Who Don't Orgasm - Psychology Today0
*By replies in last 2 weeks.
In The Media(Posts)
Woman urges NC lawmakers to end child marriage: For her it was a ‘life sentence’3
COVID-19 and the Increased Likelihood of Affairs3
Does anyone remember this story?3
Validation to find-win-win slutions2
Things men want4
These Are The Signs You're Dating A Narcissist3
Girlfriend's 'controlling' list of 22 rules for boyfriend goes viral: 'She sounds crazy'9
What Divorced Men Wish They Had Done Differently In Their Marriages7
Alienation of Affection / Criminal Conversation9
Would you pay your ex a 'break-up fee'? - BBC3
more >>
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair #4644
09/18/10 01:56 PM
09/18/10 01:56 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,010
star*fish Offline OP
Board of Directors
star*fish  Offline OP
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,010
Need engineer to flesh out this topic.

Possible subjects:

*how do affairs start?
*links to Shirley Glass articles and tests
*who has affairs?
*the science behind affairs...brain chemistry

etc.

Last edited by star*fish; 09/18/10 05:07 PM.

"Yes, I'll have the love combo, open faced with a side of respect and large a glass of forgiveness, easy on the ice please--my brother
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: star*fish] #4674
09/18/10 04:42 PM
09/18/10 04:42 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Let me see what I can come up with and I might call on Larry for some help.

Mark


mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #4677
09/18/10 05:06 PM
09/18/10 05:06 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,010
star*fish Offline OP
Board of Directors
star*fish  Offline OP
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,010
Fabulous!


"Yes, I'll have the love combo, open faced with a side of respect and large a glass of forgiveness, easy on the ice please--my brother
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: star*fish] #4678
09/18/10 05:09 PM
09/18/10 05:09 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,010
star*fish Offline OP
Board of Directors
star*fish  Offline OP
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,010
I'm renaming this thread.


"Yes, I'll have the love combo, open faced with a side of respect and large a glass of forgiveness, easy on the ice please--my brother
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #4681
09/18/10 05:51 PM
09/18/10 05:51 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,381
Texas
Larry Offline
Member
Larry  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,381
Texas
Originally Posted by Mark1952
Let me see what I can come up with and I might call on Larry for some help.

Mark


I will help all I can. Your writing skills and knowledge base are so far better than mine, I dunno how much I can do. That said, I can contribute triggers grin I am a halfway decent editor, and I can add some information/viewpoint that might help you and which you can incorporate into your stuff.

I know just enough to maybe spot something left out, or whatever. Tell me what you want me to do, I will then do my best. Heck, I have been thinking you have the capability to write a book and the knowledge.

Larry

Last edited by Larry; 09/18/10 05:52 PM.

It's often the truth we hide from ourselves that causes the most damage in life.

My old email address no longer works.
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Larry] #4692
09/18/10 06:40 PM
09/18/10 06:40 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
But you have more time than me as well, so if you feed it or even send me links you have read to see if they are worth pursuing, I'll read them when I have time and try to make something coherent out of all of it.

I've started my first post and so far have gotten about 50 words down on paper (well, they're written in "electrum and pixel dust", but you know what I mean) because I'm at work and actually had someone come in once it stopped raining...


mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #4707
09/18/10 08:55 PM
09/18/10 08:55 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,381
Texas
Larry Offline
Member
Larry  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,381
Texas

My basic research is done from Monday morning through Friday afternoon. Then I get my kid every weekend and it is his time. I do post on weekends, but my project time is limited. When he is out of school, I sometimes start on Thursday - but that still leaves me plenty of time to give you input.

Larry


It's often the truth we hide from ourselves that causes the most damage in life.

My old email address no longer works.
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Larry] #4709
09/18/10 08:58 PM
09/18/10 08:58 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 344
Aotearoa New Zealand
KiwiJ Offline
Member
KiwiJ  Offline
Member
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 344
Aotearoa New Zealand
I'd be happy to add to this if anyone is interested. I think it's possible that someone who has been there could add quite a lot to this topic. I do have limited time though.


Jen

FWW 18 month PA 2002-2003 (old HS boyfriend)
Happily Married :o)

I'm a bear of little brain and big words bother me.
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: KiwiJ] #4746
09/19/10 02:02 AM
09/19/10 02:02 AM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Jen,

Feel free to contribute whatever crosses your mind and we'll hire an editor (or debateboxing referee) as needed.

ETA: Next post is my start. Let's have adds, edits, suggestion or input while I work on more.


Last edited by Mark1952; 09/19/10 02:04 AM.

mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #4748
09/19/10 02:14 AM
09/19/10 02:14 AM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
What Is An Affair?

For the purposes of this discussion we are talking about a romantic affair and not political affairs or what might simply be called "matters" such as having ones affairs in order or event as in "The evening was a large affair."

Webster's defines an affair: a romantic or passionate attachment typically of limited duration.

Mary Ann Romans at Families.com says this about an affair is: "We all know the definition of an affair, don't we? But wait! Go ahead and try to define it and it may not be so black and white. Behavior that might be seen as an affair by one couple or even one individual may not been seen as an affair by your own definition or vice versa."

Wikipedia directs this definition of affair to the word infidelity and says this about it: "Infidelity is a violation of the mutually agreed-upon rules or boundaries of an intimate relationship, which constitutes a significant to extreme breach, or outright default, on the implicit good faith contract of a relationship, or a betrayal of core shared values with which the integrity and nature of the relationship is defined. In common use, it describes an act of unfaithfulness to one's husband, wife, or lover, whether sexual or non-sexual in nature."

Hub Pages blogger Veronica recalls a definition given by Oprah that went something like this: "It is cheating if you would behave differently if your partner were watching."

What is or is not infidelity, cheating or having an affair can vary widely from culture to culture, and even within a culture. What might be considered betrayal by some might not be thought of as such by another. Among swingers who might swap sexual partners freely having an afternoon sexual liaison might not be that shocking but finding out that their spouse was sending or receiving endearing notes and cards from someone else might be the ultimate act of betrayal. More importantly what you might consider to be a case of innocent flirting might be to your spouse an act of betrayal on a par with the attack on the World Trade Center that fateful morning of September 11, 2001.

For those that have experienced betrayal by their spouse, the feelings are much the same as those who lost loved ones that autumn day as the entire world watched in horror. Nothing prepares a person for being betrayed and those that have lived through it forever point to it as a defining moment in their lives.

Though some manage to save their marriage and still others not only survive but somehow build a marriage stronger than it was before, for the person whose spouse has cheated few things can compare to the shock, fear, emotional pain and stress of being betrayed by the one person you trusted above all others. Those that do recover learn important lessons about life, love and fidelity that few who have not lived it can comprehend.

Marriage coach Steven Harley says this about the subject: "Asking others to define the term for you is not the answer. If you boil it all down, you are left with the fact that you both need to work together in developing a plan to prevent this "beast" from ever attacking your marriage again. If you don't know what it looks like, if you don't know where it hides, if you don't know what its touch feels like, then how will you ever protect your marriage from its venom again?"

Ultimately the definition of betrayal belongs to the betrayed. If you feel your spouse has been unfaithful in some action or relationship outside the marriage, the personal trauma is the same whether that act of betrayal was a one night stand, a ten year long romantic relationship with a secret lover and a dozen emails to someone never met in person expressing undying love or overwhelming lust.

Finally betrayal is identified by the feeling of being betrayed. It is a violation of trust on the part of the person you had place so much trust in and if you feel you were betrayed, it feels like betrayal and no one can challenge the way you feel and tell you that you should feel differently, especially the one who has betrayed you.

Last edited by Mark1952; 12/03/11 03:57 PM.

mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #4751
09/19/10 03:23 AM
09/19/10 03:23 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,381
Texas
Larry Offline
Member
Larry  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,381
Texas

Let me try an edit and then hand it back. To replace words Mark originally used, I have added [words]. Blue means I suggest a rewrite. Mark, accept or reject as you will, won't hurt my feelings one way or the other.

Originally Posted by Mark1952
What Is An Affair?

For our purposes of course [the purposes of this discussion], we are talking about a romantic affair and not political affairs or what might simply be called "matters" such as having ones affairs in order or [an] event as in "The evening was a large affair."

Webster's defines an affair: a romantic or passionate attachment typically of limited duration.

Mary Ann Romans at Families.com says this about an affair is: "We all know the definition of an affair, don't we? But wait! Go ahead and try to define it and it may not be so black and white. Behavior that might be seen as an affair by one couple or even one individual may not been seen as an affair by your own definition or vice versa."

Wikipedia directs this definition of affair to the word infidelity and says this about it: "Infidelity is a violation of the mutually agreed-upon rules or boundaries of an intimate relationship, which constitutes a significant to extreme breach, or outright default, on the implicit good faith contract of a relationship, or a betrayal of core shared values with which the integrity and nature of the relationship is defined. In common use, it describes an act of unfaithfulness to one's husband, wife, or lover, whether sexual or non-sexual in nature."

Hub Pages blogger Veronica recalls a definition given by Oprah that went something like this: "It is cheating if you would behave differently if your partner were watching."

[What is or is not infidelity, cheating or having an affair can vary widely from culture to culture, and even within a culture. What might be considered betrayal by some might not be thought of as such by another. Among swingers who might swap sexual partners freely having an afternoon sexual liaison might not be that shocking but finding out that their spouse was sending or receiving endearing notes and cards from someone else might be the ultimate act of betrayal. More importantly what you might consider to be a case of innocent flirting might be to your spouse an act of betrayal on a par with the attack on the World Trade Center that fateful morning of September 11, 2001.

For thosethat [who] have experienced betrayal by their spouse, the feelings are much the same as those who lost loved ones that autumn day as the entire world watched in horror. Nothing prepares a person for being betrayed and those that have lived through it will forever point to it as a defining moment in their lives. paragraph

Though some manage to save their marriage and still others not only survive but somehow rebuild a marriage stronger than it was before, for the person whose spouse has cheated few things can compare to the shock, fear, emotional pain and stress of being betrayed by the one person you trusted above all others. Those that who do recover learn important lessons about life, love and fidelity that few who have not lived it can comprehend.

Marriage coach Steven Harley says this about the subject: "Asking others to define the term for you is not the answer. If you boil it all down, you are left with the fact that you both need to work together in developing a plan to prevent this "beast" from ever attacking your marriage again. If you don't know what it looks like, if you don't know where it hides, if you don't know what its touch feels like, then how will you ever protect your marriage from its venom again?"

Ultimately the definition of betrayal belongs to the betrayed. If you feel your spouse has been unfaithful in some action or relationship outside the marriage, the personal trauma is the same whether that act of betrayal was a one night stand, a ten year long romantic relationship with a secret lover and a dozen emails to someone never met in person expressing undying love or overwhelming lust.

Ultimately betrayal is identified by the feeling of being betrayed. It is a violation of trust on the part of the person you had placed so much trust in and if you feel you were betrayed, it feels like betrayal and no one can challenge the way you feel and tell you that you should feel differently, especially the one who betrayed you .


Suggest integration of One Night Stand at the beginning. No clue how to do it. No clue if you deliberately left out ONS or entitlement adultery. Three kinds of adultery????? Use of the word adultery?????

Suggest swinger deal be way shorter in that most folks starting to read about affairs would tune out when they saw swinger. I dunno if there is wide spread cultural differences in what constitutes an affair except in the academic mind. Banging the next door neighbor of either sex is cheating in just about every culture in the world. But that is just me.

Suggest contractions be used for easier reading. is not = isn't

Great start.

Possible alternative start:

Call it adultery, an affair, cheating or infidelity, the act is a betrayal. It doesn't matter if it was a one night stand. It doesn't matter if it was a ten year, ten week, ten day romantic liaison or passionate emails of love exchanged over the Internet between two people who have never met. It doesn't matter if it was a heavy make out session somewhere or the services of a brothel, it is what it is.

And for most, whatever you call it, an affair is at the top of the list for betrayal. Infidelity is a betrayal not only of the spouse, it is a betrayal of the children, if any. It is a betrayal of parents, friends, fellow workers, extended family and ultimately and all too often, betrayal of the affairees themselves against each other. Just about everyone looses, including the affairees, with rare exceptions.

The slid in to the start of what you said. A strong start will grab them and keep them reading through the obligatory explanations.

The last guy I edited for said in one of his pieces: "I have a love hate relationship with my editor. I love what he does for me since he makes me think and catches stuff I missed. I hate that he might be enjoying it." grin

Larry


It's often the truth we hide from ourselves that causes the most damage in life.

My old email address no longer works.
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Larry] #4790
09/19/10 11:59 AM
09/19/10 11:59 AM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Larry,

I wasn't leaving anything out. I hadn't gotten to discussions of various forms/reasons for infidelity yet. I was just looking for a common definition.

I avoided the word adultery at this point, because an argument could be made that an EA wherein the APs never even met each other in person can't truly be adultery and I want to avoid that entire argument if possible.

That was why I chose the approach of introducing the idea that it is the betrayed that gets to set the definition and not the betrayer.

Also, your changing the word from "that" back to "who" is counter to suggestions of the grammar check of MS Word. I originally used WHO and the check suggested changing to "that" so I did. I don't care a bit and will try to figure out why MS is wanting it the other way before I finalize it.


mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #4793
09/19/10 01:38 PM
09/19/10 01:38 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,381
Texas
Larry Offline
Member
Larry  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,381
Texas


Got it.

Perhaps the two paragraphs I wrote would be better used in a just found out diatribe, kind like Wat did. I will give that one a try and YOU can edit ME. grin

Larry


It's often the truth we hide from ourselves that causes the most damage in life.

My old email address no longer works.
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Larry] #5227
09/21/10 05:51 PM
09/21/10 05:51 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Some Facts About Infidelity

Polls show that 90% of Married people disapprove of extramarital relationships. Statistics from a recent National survey indicate that 15% or wives and 25% of husbands have engaged in extramarital sex by the age of 40. When emotional affairs are factored in, these numbers jump by an additional 20%. Author of The Monogamy Myth, Peggy Vaughn has suggested that as many as 60% of husbands and 40% of wives will have an extramarital affair of some type during the course of their marriage.

If you consider that not all of these people cited by Vaughn and others cheat on each other, some experts have stated that as many as 80% of all marriages are affected by infidelity at one time or another. Some of these affairs go undetected and yet 65% of the discovered affairs typically end in divorce. This leaves a large number of marriages that do recover in one form or another.

Dr. Robert Huizenga says that while these numbers may seem extremely high, considering the number of affairs he encounters in his practice he does not feel that those percentages are "off the charts" as he states it.

A report issued by the US Department of Health in 2005 stated that divorce costs the US economy 112 billion dollars annually. For those caught up in infidelity whether as betrayer or the betrayed, the emotional and physical costs can be devastating well beyond the financial costs.

According to various experts there are between 4 and seven types of affair. Most of these however can be summed up into basic categories. These according to Frank Pittman, author of Private Lies: Infidelity and the Betrayal of Intimacy are:

  • Accidental Infidelity
  • Philandering Infidelity
  • Random Infidelity
  • Romantic Infidelity


Subsets of each exist including Conflicted Romantic Infidelity in which a person has strong emotional connection and even love for more than one person at a time. Another subset is Commemorative Infidelity in which it may be important to keep up the appearance of an ongoing marriage while not really having any feelings for the spouse or even a commitment to keeping the relationship alive. Cathy Meyer of ABOUT.COM also lists what she calls Obligatory Infidelity in which a person feels that to turn down an opportunity to engage in sex with someone who makes advances somehow will result in rejection and it is the fear of that rejection that will lead some to follow through on the advances of that person. I personally think this still falls into the realm of Random Infidelity or Accidental Infidelity depending on circumstances.




Last edited by Mark1952; 12/03/11 04:01 PM.

mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #5251
09/21/10 07:08 PM
09/21/10 07:08 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Seven Myths About InfidelityDr Frank Pittman lists 7 myths about affairs that I think need to be addressed before going much further. These 7 myths according to Dr Pittman are:
  • Having an affair will improve my marriage
  • If there is an affair, this means that one doesn't love his/her wife/husband
  • The affair partner must be sexier or more beautiful/handsome than the spouse
  • Everybody does it, it is normal and natural to be unfaithful because we are susceptible to it and so it is human nature to cheat
  • The betrayed spouse causes it to happen
  • There is safety in keeping a secret and as long as the affair remains hidden it will have no impact on the marriage
  • If infidelity is revealed a divorce is inevitable


Having an affair will improve my marriage:
There is nothing that indicates that an affair is a viable way to improve a marriage. It is one of the most painful experiences a person who has been betrayed can ever encounter in his or her life. Some have compared it to the loss of a loved one, even the loss of a child and others have likened the emotional trauma to that of rape. Though many marriages that have recovered from infidelity are stronger, better and more vibrant than before the affair it is the changes that are made by both husband and wife and not the affair that led to that result.

If there is an affair, this means that one doesn't love his/her wife/husband:
Infidelity typically is not an indication that the cheater does not love his/her mate. An additional myth that this points to is that happy marriages are never affected by infidelity. Yet because of the subset of Conflicted Infidelity I referred to in my previous post, it can be said that it is in fact possible to love more than one person and even more than one person at a time. We can explore various models for love and what it is and is not and how it comes about but that will be in another post.

The affair partner must be sexier or more beautiful/handsome than the spouse:
There is no evidence that even the cheater actually considers the affair partner to be sexier or better looking in most affairs. It has been observed that a person having an affair will often "affair down." That is, a man might have an affair with a woman he doesn't really want to have a lasting relationship with and even someone he might not be willing to take to public places.

This might not be true for all affairs but it certainly has been played out in reports of famous men caught in adultery that have come to light in our mainstream media. A recent example of this might be the case of Tiger Woods who was married to a woman who by most accounts was quite beautiful. Another even more recent example in the news could be Jesse James who cheated on his wife Sandra Bullock with a woman who is at the very least rather eccentric in her appearance. While beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I don't think that either of these men considered his affair partner to be less physically attractive than his wife.

Everybody does it, it is normal and natural to be unfaithful because we are susceptible to it and so it is human nature to cheat:
As I stated in my previous post, 90% of all adults surveyed indicated that they believed that infidelity is wrong. In most cultures marriage is designed to be exclusive and even in societies where polygamy or polygyny, a married person who goes outside of the marriage to have sex with the spouse of another person is considered anathema. In some cultures adultery is punishable by death and so it seems that almost everyone is not doing it and it does not seem to me to be inevitable that a person cheats on his or her spouse. When it comes to it being human nature, this too is really not a defense for having an affair. There are many things that might be within our very nature that we have learned to control or that are regarded as inappropriate behavior in most societies.

The betrayed spouse causes it to happen:
If you have been betrayed, rest assured that you did not cause it to happen. The choice to cheat was entirely that of your wayward spouse. No matter what the state of your marriage leading up to the affair, cheating was never a way to improve the relationship. Reasons people give for cheating will be discussed later but rest assured that the cheater is the one that allowed the affair to happen and many things could have been done to prevent the affair if they had chosen to act on those things rather than to cheat.

No matter what the conditions within a marriage, having an affair is never an acceptable response. If the marriage was truly a horrible one with abuse, neglect, failure to meet needs or any other complaint the cheater might give for having the affair, other options were available that did not involve going outside the marriage for a remedy. If a marriage is bad enough to end, then it should be ended. If the marriage is broken, attempts can be made to repair it and address complaints of both spouses. The affair happened because the cheater believed incorrectly that having an affair would somehow fix or supply what was missing from the marriage and that it was perfectly acceptable to find that solution with someone else. It was not an acceptable solution and only traded one set of problems for another.

There is safety in keeping a secret and as long as the affair remains hidden it will have no impact on the marriage:
In a typical affair the affair partners don't really spend a lot of time together. Most of their efforts and time are used arranging to be together. It is often the thrill of the hunt or the "naughty" nature of the affair that gives the affair its luster and attraction. When the affair is discovered it is most often not just the act of betrayal but the lies told to cover it up that inflict the greatest damage on the betrayed spouse and on the marriage.

What always amazes me is that when caught in adultery a cheater will sometimes speak of seeking greater intimacy as being the reason they had an affair. To be really known and to know another person at a deeper level is said to be the driving force that led to the affair. Yet many times things the person having an affair has complaints about have not been communicated to the betrayed spouse and once the affair is underway, secrecy becomes the hallmark in the marriage.

One other thought on secrecy and cheating before I move on I think is in order. At times a person caught in infidelity will say that the new relationship is right for various reasons. They will express undying love for the affair partner or claim that they are soul mates and other such apparent nonsense. They will make many efforts to make the affair not only reasonable but also acceptable. Yet these very same individuals have kept the affair a secret and if it were either inevitable or reasonable and acceptable, why was it necessary to prevent others from knowing about it? The reasons for keeping it a secret are obvious to most outsiders of the affair. It was kept secret in order to minimize the possibility of personal loss or being considered something horrible if the affair were to be discovered. If it were the right thing to do, the waywards should be shouting it from the rooftops, yet many fear the discovery of their secret more than the loss of the affair itself.

If infidelity is revealed a divorce is inevitable:
The final myth of infidelity I'd like to talk about is that it inevitably leads to divorce. There are some here for whom that was the case and others posting here that did not experience that to be true. Each affair, each couple are unique in many ways and though affairs many have things in common that can make them seem uncanny in similarity, one thing that is not always common is the ability to repair the relationship as opposed to getting a divorce.

If your wife or husband had an affair, it does not need to spell the end of your marriage. As the betrayed spouse the choice of which way to proceed is up to you but weigh your choice carefully. Recovery from having been cheated on is possible though it will take significant amounts of time and effort if you choose to pursue it rather than jumping to immediate divorce.

Last edited by Mark1952; 12/03/11 04:06 PM.

mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #5342
09/22/10 01:50 AM
09/22/10 01:50 AM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Editor...

Oh, Editor...



mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #5588
09/22/10 10:03 PM
09/22/10 10:03 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,505
Amadahy Offline
Member
Amadahy  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,505
If its okay I can be editor...but strickly from an EA rock star place...not content

Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Amadahy] #5592
09/22/10 10:16 PM
09/22/10 10:16 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
I was hopin' Larry might have comments, but I guess he's busy doin' stuff and stuff...

ETA: But if you have something to say, let's hear it!

Last edited by Mark1952; 09/22/10 10:17 PM.

mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #5593
09/22/10 10:16 PM
09/22/10 10:16 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,505
Amadahy Offline
Member
Amadahy  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,505
Seven Myths About Infidelity
Dr Frank Pittman lists 7 myths about affairs that I think need to be addressed before going much further. These 7 myths according to Dr Pittman are:
Having an affair will improve my marriage
If there is an affair, this means that one doesn't love his/her wife/husband
The affair partner must be sexier and more beautiful than the spouse
Everybody does it, it is normal and natural to be unfaithful because we are susceptible to it and so it is human nature to cheat
The betrayed spouse causes it to happen
The belief that there is safety in keeping a secret and as long as the affair remains hidden it will have no impact on the marriage
If infidelity is revealed a divorce is inevitable

There is nothing that indicates that an affair is a viable way to improve a marriage. It is one of the most painful experiences a person can ever encounter in their life. Some have compared it to the loss of a loved one, even the loss of a child and others have likened the emotional trauma to that of rape. Though some marriages that have recovered from infidelity are stronger, better and more vibrant than before the affair, it is the changes that are made by both husband and wife and not the affair that led to that result.

Infidelity, typically, is not an indication that the cheater does not love his/her mate. An additional myth that this points to is that happy marriages are never affected by infidelity. Yet because of the subset of Conflicted Infidelity, I referred to in my previous post, it can be said that it is in fact possible to love more than one person and even more than one person at a time. WE can explore various models for love and what it is and is not and how it comes about but that will be in another post.

SR note: infidelity can also occur do to one spouses depression or self deception and have very little to do with their betrayed spouse. They can truly believe that they love their spouse and that the cheating is about their needs and has nothing to do with the betrayed spouse. I know I used this to justify my behavior leading up to my ONS. I loved my husband, never stopped, it was about my needs not him)

There is no evidence that the cheater actually considers the affair partner to be sexier or better looking in most affairs. It has been observed that a person having an affair will often "affair down." That is, a man might have an affair with a woman he doesn't really want to have a lasting relationship with and even someone he might not be willing to take to public places.

This might not be true for all affairs, but it certainly has been played out in reports of famous men caught in adultery n the mainstream media. A recent example of this might be the case of Tiger Woods who was married to a woman who, by most accounts, is quite beautiful. Another even more recent example in the news could be Jesse James, who cheated on his wife Sandra Bullock. He cheated with a woman who, at the very least, is rather eccentric in her appearance. While beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I don't think that either of these men considered his affair partner to be less physically attractive than his wife.

As I stated in my previous post, 90% of all adults surveyed indicated that they believed that infidelity is wrong. In most cultures marriage is designed to be exclusive. Even in societies where polygamy or polygyny is acceptable, a married person who goes outside of the marriage to have sex with the spouse of another person is considered anathema. In some cultures adultery is punishable by death and so it seems that almost everyone is not doing it. In fact, it does not seem to me to be inevitable that a person cheats on his or her spouse. When it comes to it being human nature, this too, is really not a defense for having an affair. There are many things that might be within our very nature that we have learned to control or that are regarded as inappropriate behavior in most societies.

If you have been betrayed, rest assured that you did not cause it to happen. The choice to cheat was entirely that of your wayward spouse. No matter what the state of your marriage leading up to the affair, cheating was never a way to improve the relationship. Reasons people give for cheating will be discussed later but rest assured that the cheater is the one that allowed the affair to happen. Many things could have been done to prevent the affair if they had chosen to act on those things rather than to cheat.

No matter what the conditions within a marriage, having an affair is never an acceptable response. If the marriage was truly a horrible one with abuse, neglect, failure to meet needs or any other complaint the cheater might give for having the affair, other options were available that did not involve going outside the marriage for a remedy. If a marriage is bad enough to end, then it should be ended. If the marriage is broken, attempts can be made to repair it and address complaints of both spouses. The affair happened because the cheater believed, incorrectly, that having an affair would somehow fix or supply what was missing from the marriage. They believed that it was perfectly acceptable to find that solution with someone else. It was not an acceptable solution and only traded one set of problems for another.

Last edited by SisteReed; 09/22/10 10:35 PM.
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Amadahy] #5594
09/22/10 10:17 PM
09/22/10 10:17 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,505
Amadahy Offline
Member
Amadahy  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,505
Mark, I hope this is okay to say.

You are found of run on sentences. I broke up your sentence structure to more small bites and less big hunks of data. I added some commas and fixed some typos. I am half way through. Is this okay?

Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Amadahy] #5596
09/22/10 10:19 PM
09/22/10 10:19 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
How about a different color or sumpin so I can see the additions or changes...

I'm far from done, BTW. I've been reading a whole BUNCH of stuff as time allows and getting even more recent information to add.

Mark


mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #5597
09/22/10 10:19 PM
09/22/10 10:19 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Knock yourself out...


mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Mark1952] #5602
09/22/10 10:31 PM
09/22/10 10:31 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,505
Amadahy Offline
Member
Amadahy  Offline
Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,505
a different color - oh man - when i copy n paste from word it loses my track changes...They were comas, typos and sometimes making one sentence into two...

Last edited by SisteReed; 09/22/10 10:36 PM.
Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Larry] #5612
09/22/10 10:49 PM
09/22/10 10:49 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7,470
right here waiting Offline
Board of Directors
President
right here waiting  Offline
Board of Directors
President
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 7,470
Originally Posted by Larry

The last guy I edited for said in one of his pieces: "I have a love hate relationship with my editor. I love what he does for me since he makes me think and catches stuff I missed. I hate that he might be enjoying it." grin

Larry


Larry! A fellow editor! I love it. Having been an editor for years, I DID enjoy it. But not because I delighted in finding others' mistakes. What gratified me was taking good, solid information and making it clearer, smoother, and yes...grammatically correct. Loved the writing part of my job, but editing someone else's good thoughts was better--because I learned something in the process.

Mark, as a former English teacher, I can say unequivocally that the grammar check is more often WRONG than right! In fact, I have always disabled the thing, it's that bad.

Re "That" or "Who." When referring to people, it is always "who," so Larry nailed it, and grammer check is wrong (again).

All that said, I don't think anyone coming here for help gives a rat's patootie whether we are grammatically correct or not. It's getting the information right that matters. IMHO.

Re: Marks construction site: Anatomy of an Affair [Re: Amadahy] #5700
09/23/10 02:41 AM
09/23/10 02:41 AM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Mark1952 Online
Board of Directors
Mark1952  Online
Board of Directors
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,073
SW Chicago 'burbs
Originally Posted by SisteReed

SR note: Infidelity can also occur dodue to one spouse's depression or self deception and have very little to do with their betrayed spouse. They can truly believe that they love their spouse and that the cheating is about their needs and has nothing to do with the betrayed spouse. I know I used this to justify my behavior leading up to my ONS. I loved my husband, never stopped, it was about my needs not him)

You don't mind if I do a nit of editing of your stuff as well, do ya?



mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  Chrysalis 

Newest Members
Love_Smacked, starfire, JoyfulMimi, bruers, shattered72
2048 Registered Users
Latest Topics(Posts)
Hearts Blessing5
Woman urges NC lawmakers to end child marriage: For her it was a ‘life sentence’3
63 Marriage Facts1
COVID-19 and the Increased Likelihood of Affairs3
Updates Divorce Stats4
no more rainbow members?9
BR - The Art of War - Sun Tzu5
Questions & Answers About Marriage---responses from 7-10 year old kids4
seeing new members on mobile version5
Return of the Goddess31
Community Information
2048Members
1Penalty Box
6Suspended

42

Forums
8500Topics
463397Posts
 
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.1.1
(Release build 20180111)
Page Time: 0.027s Queries: 15 (0.005s) Memory: 3.4021 MB (Peak: 3.8007 MB) Zlib enabled in php.ini Server Time: 2021-11-29 12:14:52 UTC