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#85637 - 03/23/11 05:18 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: BabyDoll]
Mary Emma
Member

Registered: 10/17/10
Posts: 4591
Yup SFB,
I should not thread jack or in any way attack you personally.
I will PM you.
_________________________
Me 41
H 40
S 9
S 6

I want to live in a world where George Zimmerman offered Trayvon Martin a ride home to get him out of the rain that night. -Bishop G. Brewer

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#85686 - 03/23/11 06:11 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: BabyDoll]
cartwheel
Member

Registered: 03/09/11
Posts: 190
I have a question (and hope it isn't a dumb one) -- but how do you know when you are in "recovery?" And, does "recovery" have an end date?

Just curious to hear from those who have succeeded ...

Sorry if I'm hijacking your thread I"m happy to post somewhere else. But, I think it fits? :-)
_________________________
Me(43) H (49)
M - 16 yrs
S (13)
D (11)
S (8)
D (6)
DDay #1 3/7/2011
DDay #2 4/8/2011
In Recovery

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#85694 - 03/23/11 06:27 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: cartwheel]
Mark1952
Board of Directors
Member

Registered: 08/29/10
Posts: 4970
Loc: SW Chicago 'burbs
Recovery is over when you can say you are recovered...

Typically about two years if both of you are working at recovering but YMMV...

While I'm here-

My wife had an affair in 06 that was the rekindling of what proved to be an EA after no contact was maintained for 13 months.

Stage 1 of our recovery was in learning to apply MB concepts in our marriage.

Stage 2 was when we began teach MB concept to others together in the fall of 09.

Stage 3 began when we attended training for certification to lead a program that applies MB concepts to help other couples.

Stage 4 is that we now run the marriage ministry at our church, lead classes, meet with a few couples and we each meet with spouses of the same gender to discuss ways of improving marriages, mainly by applying MB concepts and vocabulary.

People now see us as the people to come to with their own problems, so I guess we're recovered.

We'll be married for 38 years in August...

It was touch and go for a while there.
_________________________
mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman

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#85730 - 03/23/11 07:27 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: Mark1952]
Thirty78
Member

Registered: 12/28/10
Posts: 956
I think that almost everyone sees things as a technique when they first come here (or any marriage saving board) they are looking for cures. They're looking for fixes. Most of them aren't interested in making their life better they just want to get their spouse back.

Eventually though, they can see the things like 180s for what they are. Ive come up with two so far. I always wanted my nose pierced (ex hates that) so I never did it. I don't care what he thinks anymore, so I'm doing it. I always wanted to try belly dancing, but with my body issues and 'no time' I never did. Now I will be! Between the lbs diet and some good old fashioned self esteem, im ready to do new things! And kick boxing too! I'm excited about all the new things i can do for me now, without worrying about ex and his thoughts about my choices. Very liberating. So while my marriage was not saved, and I don't even want to save it anymore, I'm still applying my learned techniques to make my life better. As awful as this has been, as painful, it really was one of the best things that could have happened. It got me off my arse to fix what was broken with me. I'm in recovery.. Without H. And that's ok by me. smile
_________________________
Me: 31
Kids: 10, 8, 3
Bomb: 08/10
The rest doesn't matter.

No longer lost... A blog

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#85734 - 03/23/11 07:36 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: Thirty78]
Lil
Member

Registered: 08/30/10
Posts: 7378
Loc: Ness
Originally Posted By: Thirty78
I always wanted my nose pierced (ex hates that) so I never did it. I don't care what he thinks anymore, so I'm doing it.


LOL! I did something very similar. I had always wanted to pierce my ears multiple times, but DH wouldnt 'let' me. One of the first things I did once I understood the working on myself part of the plan was pierce my ears.
When he saw them for the first time he tried to make a comment about being run over by a sewing machine, until I pointed out he had no say anymore smile
_________________________
AKA Lildoggie

Just found out about your spouses affair?
Infidelity Guide For The Betrayed Spouse



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#85777 - 03/23/11 08:36 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: Thirty78]
D4MIL
Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 1959
Quote:
So while my marriage was not saved, and I don't even want to save it anymore, I'm still applying my learned techniques to make my life better. As awful as this has been, as painful, it really was one of the best things that could have happened. It got me off my arse to fix what was broken with me. I'm in recovery.. Without H. And that's ok by me.

claps
i agree. and it is very liberating to do what you want to do .. and not worry about whether somebody else is going to like it or not.

that's really what doing a 180 should be about. it makes you happy .. puts a smile on your face and you feel confident. that makes you uber attractive.

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#85807 - 03/23/11 09:14 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: D4MIL]
freshstart11
Member

Registered: 12/15/10
Posts: 351
I could agree more Thirty and D4MIL, very well said!

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#85829 - 03/23/11 09:42 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: freshstart11]
peppermint
Member

Registered: 02/20/11
Posts: 2681
Loc: Carolina Blue Heaven
I noticed that a time of two years was mentioned for how long it takes for recovery. I once read on MB that the amount of time it takes for recovery is related to both the length of the marriage and the length of the affair. That makes sense to me. Where did the time of two years come from, is that personal experience?

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#85884 - 03/23/11 11:45 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: peppermint]
Mark1952
Board of Directors
Member

Registered: 08/29/10
Posts: 4970
Loc: SW Chicago 'burbs
Peppermint,

I will look for the reference but it was something I read about 3 weeks into my journey. It was in fact something I learned at MB.

When I say typical I do not mean the average or the normal time. Typical for me indicates a statistical probability thing more along the lines of median time in duration.

I have known folks who declared recovery complete in as little as six months and know some that still struggle trying to get it right 5 years after reconciliation began.

I know that some in the industry say it can take as long as the affair itself lasted and others say that longer history together makes it easier to achieve while other experts claim that long history can actually delay the process if the history includes serious reasons for resentment outside of the affair.

Again, the two year time frame also assumes that both are working at making things better and actually doing things that lead to having a better marriage. This is not always the reality for many couples.

As a matter of support for that number, the average time that couples remain in marriage counseling is 18 months to two years depending on which school of counseling is doing the reporting. Gottman's followers seem to keep clients in office a bit longer than some but some of the advocates of self help kinds of therapy or who tend to chase down FOO issues before doing much in the way of helping the couple reunite can take a lot longer. Couples who drop out before 18 months are more likely to get a divorce. Couples who remain stuck much beyond two years seem to have repeat problems that return them to counseling at a later date.

Couples that see the whole thing as something they need to fix together, calling it OUR problem, tend to recover faster than those who play the point-counterpoint game over and over. Those I have witnessed struggle the longest are those who expect a reasonable answer to the question "Why" before taking a chance on doing what leads to a better marriage.

Two years is also about the typical time for people to mourn a serious loss of any sort and feeling secure in yourself is a big part of recovery.

_________________________
mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman

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#85926 - 03/24/11 03:32 AM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: Mark1952]
cartwheel
Member

Registered: 03/09/11
Posts: 190
Mark --

You mentioned the below ...

Stage 3 began when we attended training for certification to lead a program that applies MB concepts to help other couples.

How can I find someone by me who fits these qualifications? I am nervous to find a marriage counselor because I'm not sure which ones are "pro-marriage" and, the wrong one, could be somewhat disasterous at this point. But, I think I might be willing to consider someone who has learned MB concepts ...
_________________________
Me(43) H (49)
M - 16 yrs
S (13)
D (11)
S (8)
D (6)
DDay #1 3/7/2011
DDay #2 4/8/2011
In Recovery

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#85927 - 03/24/11 03:40 AM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: Mark1952]
MariaK
Member

Registered: 01/08/11
Posts: 134
I am a natural brunette and went blonde when I started focusing on me. I went out, met friends that I had not seen for ages, wore clothes that fit my new minus 9kilos body, was laughing and having fun with my kids, getting my energy back and most of all, in the middle of the whole mess, I started being grateful. Grateful for my life, my kids, my parents, my brother, my friends. I stopped being super judgemental, I started having FAITH.

I was living better, all these 180s for me just as Db was saying and...H noticed. And he showed interest. And I was discreet, didnt try to "show him". And he started enjoying being around me while he was dropping off kids. I did the whole DB cycle, became "friendly, polite, etc etc", I didnt accommodate him (much), but I wasnt attacking him either. I wasnt acting as a victim nor as "a teacher" (which a lot of people tend to do from what I've seen).
I was moving on. And that's when his A started dying. Because SHE was pushing, she was creating problems, she was being impatient, she was pleading, begging etc (I know cause I read ALL her emails).

We are now close to 15 months (I think) of recovery. I believe we will need another year and a few more lesons to learn to consider our M recovered.

Lately I resumed activities I had abandoned for a while due to my dad's death. I can already feel how taking care of me, affects positively our relationship. I need to remember that.

MariaK
_________________________
Recovering from infidelity


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#85964 - 03/24/11 08:06 AM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: MariaK]
herfuturesbright
Member

Registered: 09/15/10
Posts: 17282
Loc: The Castle Aaaggghh...
I call my DH and I "affair-recovered." We recovered from my A in about 2 years. It was a two-way street. The non-negotiables for me (the WS) was true and ongoing repentance, humility, transparency, empathy, active protection of the M, and for me personally a commitment to bipolar treatment. These things HAD to happen, or honestly, I was not worth recovering WITH (not that I was worthless, just that DH deserved better than some selfish half-assed, still clinging to my "rights" kind of effort). I confessed my A, and he had no idea....but confession did not earn me a gold star....it's the LONG run, not the confession event, that shows the heart.

The non-negotiables for DH were things I did not impose. Now, granted, he imposed them himself in his own time, partly maybe because he saw I was actually gut level sincere and partially because of the kind of man he is....but for him: transparency, honesty, integrity, forgiveness, his own version of "letting go," which involved letting go of the past (not forgetting, but no longer holding it as armor or a weapon.

I say we are affair recovered because the affair is a non-issue. At least for him. I still struggle with what I did at times. I think one thing we kind of missed in all the emotion and work and hysterical bonding and forgiveness was......a real, life altering examination of our marriage as a whole. I admit now that I was not as open about the things that REALLY affected me in our M because I felt I had no right. And it is those things that, if they do not change, will come closer to wrecking marital recovery than my A. The A was a temporary abbheration of character that thankfully I woke up from and worked like heck to help us heal from. The day to day dynamic and "habits" of the M......those need work.

I guess I share that to say that though the temptation for both a WS and a BS is to focus completely on the A and breathe a sigh of relief once it's "over," in some ways, the real, mundane, has to happen for the M to be healthy, work never ends.

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#86211 - 03/24/11 04:21 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: herfuturesbright]
peppermint
Member

Registered: 02/20/11
Posts: 2681
Loc: Carolina Blue Heaven
If someone asked me how long our recovery took I am not sure I could say! We went through a period of non recovery after the affair, a time I would refer to as survival. I would guess that our recovery started in October/November of 2001. Even now our relationship continues to evolve because of the affair, the resulting counseling, and our increased marriage intelligence. Still, I keep hoping for the elusive "better than before the affair" that those MB hardliners keep insisting on!

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#86394 - 03/24/11 11:26 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: peppermint]
OTS12
Member

Registered: 01/10/11
Posts: 1450
Loc: US
Well, I'm on Day 1 of recovery.

Wish me luck.
_________________________
Trying my hardest.
Learning every day.

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#86425 - 03/25/11 12:37 AM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: OTS12]
Chrysalis
Global Moderator
Member

Registered: 08/30/10
Posts: 5426
Loc: SoCal
(((OTS)))
_________________________
Chrysalis

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#86492 - 03/25/11 09:00 AM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: OTS12]
SunnyD
Member

Registered: 10/12/10
Posts: 2211
Originally Posted By: OTS12
Well, I'm on Day 1 of recovery.

Wish me luck.


Hang in there!! It can be all over the place for the first month or so. You go from feeling relieved and just happy to be back together to unexplicable sadness of having to let the pain back in because you're letting your spouse back in. Then, of course, there are bouts of anger, yet bouts of joy as well. At least, that's the way it was for me - very manic-depressive.

Wishing you the best!!!! hug


Edited by SunnyD (03/25/11 09:10 AM)

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#86496 - 03/25/11 09:09 AM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: OTS12]
TimeHeals
Member

Registered: 11/07/10
Posts: 3931
Loc: Tennessee
Quote:
Well, I'm on Day 1 of recovery.


How do you know?

We were reconciled for months before either one of us was sure, and still... sometimes... ya wonder smile
_________________________
Your Time Perspective Can Heal
Mend the broken, make strong the weak and vanquish the evil.

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#86648 - 03/25/11 02:56 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: cartwheel]
Mark1952
Board of Directors
Member

Registered: 08/29/10
Posts: 4970
Loc: SW Chicago 'burbs
Originally Posted By: cartwheel
Mark --

You mentioned the below ...

Stage 3 began when we attended training for certification to lead a program that applies MB concepts to help other couples.

How can I find someone by me who fits these qualifications? I am nervous to find a marriage counselor because I'm not sure which ones are "pro-marriage" and, the wrong one, could be somewhat disasterous at this point. But, I think I might be willing to consider someone who has learned MB concepts ...
CW,

The program I refer to is an eight week class that helps couples apply MB and biblical principles to their marriage. It is not usually very effective in helping couples in serious crisis and really is a waste of time for cases where an affair is still active.

It is called Dynamic Marriage and can be found at Family Dynamics. They also have a class called A New Beginning that is more for couples in crisis that can be found at http://www.savemymarriage.com or through a link from the FDI website linked above.

My wife and I are NOT trained counselors. We are not coaches license or authorized by the sate or any organization. We are what are called facilitators, granted permission to run an eight week class. We do however run our church's marriage ministry and meet with couples and individuals to offer support, advice where we might have it in our experience and prayer for those who are hurting.

As for finding a marriage counselor in your area...

Interview them. Ask them questions. Find out what marital therapy model they use. Ask about their own marriage and how they came to be a marriage counselor. Ask friends who have attended counseling, placing emphasis on couples that are still together and claim their success on their counselor's expertise and methodology. A diploma and a license do not make one an expert, IMO.
_________________________
mark1952.ma@gmail.com

I Was Thinking...

The secret to having a good marriage is to understand that marriage must be total, it must be permanent, and it must be equal.-- Frank Pittman

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#86738 - 03/25/11 07:35 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: Mark1952]
SunnyD
Member

Registered: 10/12/10
Posts: 2211
Mark: H and I went to New Beginnings back in July! I thought it was extremely helpful and we learned A LOT and have maintained friendships from that weekend.

Now, we did not come home with a "saved marriage" because unbeknownst to me, H was in the middle of an affair at that time. He'd agreed to go to the weekend because of lots of cajoling from the kids. In fact, the weekend ended with me in tears because he said in front of everyone that he was not ready to commit to our marriage and was not exactly nice about it. However, that should not deter anyone because even though that was painful, I believe a lot sunk into his head that he later remembered when the "drugs" (affair chemicals) wore off. When I discovered the affair, his actions from that weekend made a lot more sense.

ANyway, I highly recommend New Beginnings.

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#86750 - 03/25/11 07:47 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: SunnyD]
BabyDoll
Member

Registered: 01/10/11
Posts: 541
Lots of Luck coming your way OTS!!! be sure to stick to a plan, find a GREAT MC, and continue to recieve support from the vets on here!!!


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#86770 - 03/25/11 08:26 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: BabyDoll]
OTS12
Member

Registered: 01/10/11
Posts: 1450
Loc: US
Thanks!
_________________________
Trying my hardest.
Learning every day.

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#86813 - 03/25/11 09:54 PM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: OTS12]
Mary Emma
Member

Registered: 10/17/10
Posts: 4591
Concerning the question about people who have reconcilled after divorce. On DB there was someone named RedHeadWife (or something like that) who had remarried his ex (who had cheated and divorced him) 2 years after the divorce- he seemed happy. That was quite a while ago so you would have to search for his posts.

I have heard stats somewhere as to the number of people who divorce and remarry their former spouse- I can't find it tonight.
_________________________
Me 41
H 40
S 9
S 6

I want to live in a world where George Zimmerman offered Trayvon Martin a ride home to get him out of the rain that night. -Bishop G. Brewer

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#86855 - 03/26/11 02:41 AM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: Mary Emma]
Mary Emma
Member

Registered: 10/17/10
Posts: 4591
Found this website of people who have remarried their spouse some after many years. Here is one of a man hoping to marry his ex after many years of him cheating on her and marrying the OW. He is filled with regret and intent on trying to get his exwife back (many years later). Most post are those who have remarried their ex already.

http://themediansib.com/2006/11/06/marrying-an-ex-spouse/

I am in a situation that is CLOSE to these posts. Let me give you a few details.

My ex wife and I married at age 19 and 20. The reason we married was because my ex was pregnant with our son (now 18 and in college). It was a VERY difficult time, and since we both had never dated anyone else, nor been sexual with any other person, we didn't know how relationships really worked.

We stayed married for 10 years…until I started to access pornography. That was the beginning of the end for us. My ex wife, while beautiful and caring…was not an animal in bed. After seeing what women in movies did, I thought I needed to find out what sex was all about, so I began having affairs. My ex wife knew about a few of them, but chose to look the other way, "empowering me" to continue this practice. Eventually, I decided to leave her, and find a woman who was everything in bed I always wanted. I found such a woman. She was amazing…and I really thought I loved her. She gave me everything I wanted when it came to the bedroom. However, now some 7 years later and after marrying my now wife of 4 years, I have finally realized what a miserable mistake I made. I finally figured out that sex does not equal Love. I now know that Love is about respect…Admiration…Adoration and is comforting and joyful. What I didn't realize, was that these feelings were slowly developing over the last 3 years, but only became aparent to me about 18 months ago.

I stayed close friends with my ex wife, and she simply is my best friend. We do some stuff together, but only if my current wife is gone, or there is a reason to go somewhere because of the kids (Baseball, school functions etc). We have talked at great length about our love for each other, but recently, she has found a new man (about 9 months ago). A man that she enjoys VERY much. He is new, exciting, different. She currently is over in Germany (he is in the military) visiting him for a month and she does enjoy being with him. It took a long time for me to come around to the fact that my ex wife and I belong together. It also has taken God and a lot of PRAYER to bring me back from pornography and my terrible sexual ways.

My ex wife is everything I ever wanted. Perfect, blameless, amazing, gentle, a loving mother, an incredible wife, and absolutely the best friend a man could ever have.

Currently, I am still married, but in a terrible marriage. I am 99% sure that this will end soon, as sex is NO reason to stay in a marriage…especially when we have NOTHING else in common. I have finally grown up, and figured out that I need to let my ex wife figure out what SHE wants. She knows my feelings, and she knows that I love her VERY much. However, what I need to do, is let her discover what I have found. This amazing new kind of love that I have for her. The respect and admiration that I have for her now, is amazing…and truthfully, if she were to EVER decide to take me back, she has to learn to respect and love me all over again. Even though I never hit her, yelled at her, or accused her of anything, I hurt her TERRIBLY, and I have BEGGED her for forgiveness. She has forgiven me, but she has to respect me now.

This is why I now go out of my way for her. Buy her coffee's and lunches, take care of her house, fix up her car, love our kids and be the best dad I can be. If she decides I am not worth taking back, then I will wish her happiness with her new man. However, if she choses to give me one last chance, I will PROVE to her, that I am the man she always dreamed of, and I will spend the rest of my life, doing everything I can to make up for all the pain and suffering I caused her.

Patience is what I need now…and fortunately, it is one things that God is slowly teaching me.
_________________________
Me 41
H 40
S 9
S 6

I want to live in a world where George Zimmerman offered Trayvon Martin a ride home to get him out of the rain that night. -Bishop G. Brewer

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#86856 - 03/26/11 03:06 AM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: Mary Emma]
Mary Emma
Member

Registered: 10/17/10
Posts: 4591
Alright here is a statistic I found about divorce and remarriage of the same spouse:

An estimated six percent of American couples marry, divorce and then remarry each other, according to psychology professor Nancy Kalish, who researched the topic for her book Lost & Found Lovers: Facts and Fantasies of Rekindled Romances
http://glo.msn.com/beauty/we-got-remarried-to-each-other-1533156.story

_________________________
Me 41
H 40
S 9
S 6

I want to live in a world where George Zimmerman offered Trayvon Martin a ride home to get him out of the rain that night. -Bishop G. Brewer

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#86857 - 03/26/11 07:00 AM Re: Who here is in Recovery or "Fixed" their marriage... [Re: Not2fun]
Orchid2
Ambassador
Member

Registered: 09/08/10
Posts: 8846
Loc: HI
N2F,

I am sure we all have enough 'stories' to fill a series of books. grin

I thought you'd remember the 'laundry bag' story. LOL!!!!

Looking back there were lots of things going on. At the time they were all painful but I learned to deal with it by doing a lot of RB and a strong sense of humor. Since the Ow was such a powerhouse nutcase.... it was easy to laugh at her. Ws on the other hand was not as funny but he did mess up a lot (typical WS style) Reality is a strong teacher. I never wanted t/b on the wrong end of that learning curve. wink

Take care,
Orchid

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