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The next "ME TOO" movement: Domestic Violence in marriage #432135
02/10/18 04:10 PM
02/10/18 04:10 PM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,378
Utah
Kayla Offline OP
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Kayla  Offline OP
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Posts: 1,378
Utah
Today, David Sorenson resigned; the 2nd White House official to resign after accusations of domestic violence, following Rob Porter's resignation for similar reasons.

Growing up in a home with a shell-shocked father, a trauma now known as PTSD, who self-medicated by abusing alcohol. To the outside world, he was sweet and kind and everyone thought he worshiped the ground my mother walked on. Behind closed doors, he could turn into a monster at the drop of a hat. I grew up never knowing who was safe when.

Rob Porter remarried after the first wife divorced him for his behavior. The second wife also divorced him. Since he's LDS, I thought I would explain a couple things the news is distorting about the advice from their church leaders regarding divorce. Bishops do not step in and tell a woman she should divorce her husband, as a rule. They will typically refer couples to professional counselors because these are lay-ministers, usually with no clinical or professional counseling back ground, and will say as much in meetings with couples. They can counsel in regard to spiritual matters, but always defer to professionals for deeply troubling things, such as violence.

Also, because these bishops sometimes can't get past their own biases, no matter the temporary responsibilities they have, and the cognitive dissonance between what Rob presented publicly and what these women were saying couldn't penetrate those biases. Some bishops are ill equipped to deal with problems like these women presented about Rob to their leaders. The women themselves have a hard time saying directly - one news interview said this outright, that the ex wife didn't say directly that Rob was beating her up. When women speak in code, they can't expect a bishop to pick up on those subtle nuances.

On another thread in another forum, I mentioned the book, "Identity and Agency in Cultural Worlds" - important if you want to understand why men and women stay in abusive situations, particularly women as they are conditioned (thousands of years of cultural conditioning) that they are property. When you only have the last 100 years or so, where women and society see otherwise (and in some societies, still enslaved), you begin to understand the reason this is just now starting to make the news.


Consider that we don't have to live with the consequences of our advice in your life. Act according to what you can live with!
Re: The next "ME TOO" movement: Domestic Violence in marriage [Re: Kayla] #432149
02/10/18 08:01 PM
02/10/18 08:01 PM
Joined: Apr 2014
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Blair Offline
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I often hear that the LDS church has "zero tolerance" for abuse of any kind, but I have seen many situations where those same words did not match the actions that followed. I do think you are wise to clarify that some clergy have their own biases that prevent their ability to handle abuse appropriately.

Re: The next "ME TOO" movement: Domestic Violence in marriage [Re: Kayla] #432159
02/10/18 10:17 PM
02/10/18 10:17 PM
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 9,997
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SmilingWife Offline
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I would have to know what was told to the religious leader and what was admitted to buy the abusive husband. If the abusive husband lies and denies he is hitting his wife what is a religious leader to do? A religious organization is not a court of law and they cannot convict people of stuff based upon opinion and feelings. And if there is only one person who has witnessed the abuse, which of course is common in domestic violence situations then the clergy’s hands are tied as far as what they can do to the abuser. However they can offer support to the abused person by telling them that even if they cannot be proven that they were abused they still do not have to except that kind of a treatment because certainly God knows what is going on.

Re: The next "ME TOO" movement: Domestic Violence in marriage [Re: SmilingWife] #432161
02/11/18 12:33 AM
02/11/18 12:33 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,378
Utah
Kayla Offline OP
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Kayla  Offline OP
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Utah
When I was going through all my stuff with K-man, I focused on what I was going through, not what K-man was doing. I was offered IC and the Church paid the therapist fees because I didn't have the money to pay a therapist and was just trying to tough it out - I got to pick my therapist too. They've helped me when I was going through miscarriages, job changes, etc. Bishops have an amazing set of resources to draw on to help. One of my bishops had an added responsibility as "transient" bishop to help people who were stranded, out of money, broken down car, etc. Didn't matter if the stranded person was LDS or not. He'd buy tanks of gas, pay for car repairs, tires, food, shelter for a day or a week, help them with clothing, or any other needful thing.

The problem is that we're uncomfortable detailing out the nature of abuse, so we use obscure language. I listened to the 2nd ex-wife interview with CNN several times, and she was never specific with her bishop as to what Rob was doing, and with the exception of the photo of the black eye, wasn't even specific with the news media, even though she had their full attention.

Abusers hide and deflect this way.


Consider that we don't have to live with the consequences of our advice in your life. Act according to what you can live with!
Re: The next "ME TOO" movement: Domestic Violence in marriage [Re: Kayla] #432163
02/11/18 02:56 AM
02/11/18 02:56 AM
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midwest
Miranda Offline
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Miranda  Offline
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Its true. It took me FOREVER to be specific with my own therapist about what goes on in my house.


When we open to this moment and don't judge it or try to change it, even when we're suffering and wish it were otherwise, we tap into the spaciousness of mind that allows us to move forward skillfully, with discernment and joy. -- Sharon Salzberg
Re: The next "ME TOO" movement: Domestic Violence in marriage [Re: Miranda] #433572
03/10/18 01:16 AM
03/10/18 01:16 AM
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Posts: 10,664
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Orchid2 Online
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Originally Posted by Miranda
Its true. It took me FOREVER to be specific with my own therapist about what goes on in my house.



That's why places like MA serve a good purpose. We show that it is ok to talk about deep issues that need to be discussed.

I will say that most religious leaders are not properly trained to handle even A or domestic violence issues. Too often the victim and family get passed over or the incidents get minimized. I even heard one minister try to excuse a WS saying that 'well, he is an old man.' Seriously? At what age is it acceptable to victimize others?

No such thing as double standards.

The MeTwo movement has opened up the acceptance of speaking up. It also will allow those who want to make trouble both ways. Still folks should learn to focus on getting to the truth and exposing the falsehoods no matter who it is.

jmo,
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